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generaljanuarySorry, this cannot even be considered an update, this is solely to help someone with their school work. ( hope you're apraciationg M=P :p )
I don't expect comments =)
Fannie Dubé
Artistic and Literary Currens I
Achilles and Patroclus
In ancient Greek mythology and literature, a long tradition of male love can be observed. Far from being considered a deviation in these times, a relationship between two men usually followed a norm; they fell into a certain pattern that somehow gave them a sense. In the case of Achilles and Patroclus, though, all unwritten rules were transgressed. What they shared simply didn't fit into the mould of what was expected. Their similar status and undefined roles didn't make sense for the onlookers thus resulting in a deep misunderstanding of what brought them together.
The norm, for men in Ancient Greece, was bisexuality. Love between two men happened between an older, more experienced, teacher figure and a younger, beautiful, student. Respectively referred to as erastes (which stood for 'lover' in Athens and 'inspirer' in Sparta.) and eromenos (which stood for 'beloved' in Athens and 'hearer' in Sparta) . The erastes' role was to open the eyes of the eromenos , who usually was aged between fourteen and thirty, to the world. Today, such a thing might sound revolting, but in these peculiar times, the enamorous admiration and devotion of a student towards his teacher was seen as very noble and the fondness felt by the 'lover' for the 'beloved' as moral. The strong bonding was only a way to cement the knowledge the 'inspirer' had brought to his 'hearer' in a celebration of male friendship and beauty. The relationship, a complement to a heterosexual marriage for the erastes, lasted until the eromenos was aged enough to marry , usually around thirty, when he in turn became a teacher and found a student to perpetuate the tradition of male love. A relationship between two adult men was considered useless, laughable. It didn't serve a noble or moral purpose; it was incomprehensible. Achilles and Patroclus are said to have met in their childhood, to have grown friends very quickly, and later become lover. (Androphile Project) Such a thing was considered strange for their similar status didn't fit anywhere in the accepted definition of male love, which proved that their relationship is very different from what was expected of such a relationship in these times.
Not only were Achilles and Patroclus following a ridiculed pattern, but it is today still unknown who might have been the erastes and the eromenos. The importance and respect of these roles were not only important but primordial. They were not only part of a set of unwritten rules, they were what gave a sense to a relationship. What caused its existence, what made it valid. On many levels Achilles was thought of being the 'lover'. He's obviously the more dominant and he also possesses famed war skills while Patroclus would be believed to be the 'beloved', because of his inclinaison to perform different chores such as cooking and nursing. It was also argued, though, that Homer described Achilles, as being an exceptionally beautiful young man, a trait that usually marks a 'hearer'. (Wikipedia) Also, the two of them were sleeping with women, which was highly uncommon and was, to a certain extent, uncalled for. Only one of the two could usually lie with a woman, as it only applied to the role of the 'inspirer'. Achilles and Patroclus shamelessly messed around with the conventions. Their undefined roles didn't qualify them as a total part of the traditional male love.
In conclusion, Trojan war heroes Achilles and Patroclus as depicted in Homer's Iliad, most likely entertained a very uncommon homosexual relationship. Their inability to fit into the normal teacher/student pattern and their confused individual roles clearly sorted them out of the lot and have puzzled readers for centuries.
Works Cited
Androphile Project, The World History of Male Love, January 2005
20 September 2005 <http://www.androphile.org/preview/library/mythology/greek/achilles/achilles_and_patroclus.htm>
Wikipedia, Wikipedia, the free encyclopedy , last modified 28 September 2005
28 September 2005 <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/iliad>
I don't expect comments =)
Fannie Dubé
Artistic and Literary Currens I
Achilles and Patroclus
In ancient Greek mythology and literature, a long tradition of male love can be observed. Far from being considered a deviation in these times, a relationship between two men usually followed a norm; they fell into a certain pattern that somehow gave them a sense. In the case of Achilles and Patroclus, though, all unwritten rules were transgressed. What they shared simply didn't fit into the mould of what was expected. Their similar status and undefined roles didn't make sense for the onlookers thus resulting in a deep misunderstanding of what brought them together.
The norm, for men in Ancient Greece, was bisexuality. Love between two men happened between an older, more experienced, teacher figure and a younger, beautiful, student. Respectively referred to as erastes (which stood for 'lover' in Athens and 'inspirer' in Sparta.) and eromenos (which stood for 'beloved' in Athens and 'hearer' in Sparta) . The erastes' role was to open the eyes of the eromenos , who usually was aged between fourteen and thirty, to the world. Today, such a thing might sound revolting, but in these peculiar times, the enamorous admiration and devotion of a student towards his teacher was seen as very noble and the fondness felt by the 'lover' for the 'beloved' as moral. The strong bonding was only a way to cement the knowledge the 'inspirer' had brought to his 'hearer' in a celebration of male friendship and beauty. The relationship, a complement to a heterosexual marriage for the erastes, lasted until the eromenos was aged enough to marry , usually around thirty, when he in turn became a teacher and found a student to perpetuate the tradition of male love. A relationship between two adult men was considered useless, laughable. It didn't serve a noble or moral purpose; it was incomprehensible. Achilles and Patroclus are said to have met in their childhood, to have grown friends very quickly, and later become lover. (Androphile Project) Such a thing was considered strange for their similar status didn't fit anywhere in the accepted definition of male love, which proved that their relationship is very different from what was expected of such a relationship in these times.
Not only were Achilles and Patroclus following a ridiculed pattern, but it is today still unknown who might have been the erastes and the eromenos. The importance and respect of these roles were not only important but primordial. They were not only part of a set of unwritten rules, they were what gave a sense to a relationship. What caused its existence, what made it valid. On many levels Achilles was thought of being the 'lover'. He's obviously the more dominant and he also possesses famed war skills while Patroclus would be believed to be the 'beloved', because of his inclinaison to perform different chores such as cooking and nursing. It was also argued, though, that Homer described Achilles, as being an exceptionally beautiful young man, a trait that usually marks a 'hearer'. (Wikipedia) Also, the two of them were sleeping with women, which was highly uncommon and was, to a certain extent, uncalled for. Only one of the two could usually lie with a woman, as it only applied to the role of the 'inspirer'. Achilles and Patroclus shamelessly messed around with the conventions. Their undefined roles didn't qualify them as a total part of the traditional male love.
In conclusion, Trojan war heroes Achilles and Patroclus as depicted in Homer's Iliad, most likely entertained a very uncommon homosexual relationship. Their inability to fit into the normal teacher/student pattern and their confused individual roles clearly sorted them out of the lot and have puzzled readers for centuries.
Works Cited
Androphile Project, The World History of Male Love, January 2005
20 September 2005 <http://www.androphile.org/preview/library/mythology/greek/achilles/achilles_and_patroclus.htm>
Wikipedia, Wikipedia, the free encyclopedy , last modified 28 September 2005
28 September 2005 <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/iliad>
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no subject
Date: 2006-11-30 07:01 am (UTC)True. Another reason why i continue to love myths. See Xena/Hercules? XDD
-Seteshi-chan
no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 10:20 am (UTC)-Seteshi-chan
no subject
Date: 2007-08-27 10:28 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-09-03 09:13 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-09-04 03:51 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-11-30 05:06 am (UTC)QaF
Date: 2008-02-24 07:33 pm (UTC)I finally got to watch Queer as Folks.
I Love your culture, or part of it. X3
PLEASE initiate me soon, I'm a debbie, yo. ^_~
<3
^_^
Date: 2008-02-24 07:41 pm (UTC)Yo.
Just want to say. No matter even we missed out a year, and if either I /or you grew tentacles, got booked by the cops, Died, knocked up, or did/got whatever that would make a supposedly normal person balk..
I Shall always Love thee,And looking forward to the moment we connect back again here or the underworld. Later on we may build our own lifes/carreers/family/fucked ups, but know..at least I still once knew,loved,cared for you and shall try not to judge you unnesecaryly..and shall remember/aknowledge you back within a moment.
Just hold on strong,survive, brave everything as you can and put your faith in whatever you belive that would give you an extra hand to hold on.
Just know I shall try to be the best acquaitance around,yo. The internet is one of the ways of 'catching' you..but I've already founded thee long ago. Cliche as it may be, I shall never forget thee,and hope for all the best for you.
This is my pledge to you, Fannie Dube.
...
...
Thats what 1 year of not being into the English liteature scene does to me.Utter sap that anyone can debunk with a 'yeah right'. But *shrug* My main point. Never think thee are forgotten by meh.Lets hug and feel better that we have renewed a year membership of the freindship club yah?(Bah. Think we only can do this freindship thing in a 70's day care playground?Nonsense,yo)
Loving thee always,
Stacy.
(Maybe shall dip my toes in the pool of having the enjoyment of cuddling girls my age soon. XD)
Re: ^_^
Date: 2008-02-29 02:35 am (UTC)Sitting in an internet cafe. In another city. Far from home and warmth and safety.
I'm visiting Montreal city on my own like the big 20 years old girl I've become for a Hawksley workman concert and it reminds me that my last actual post in this blog was to annouce another Hawksley Workman concert. Two years ago.
And I'm utterly alone in this city that is too big and too cold and I glimpse a peek in here and find that you've been here no less than four days ago.
Once we were talking awkwardly over the phone or instant messaging, and now I feel closest to you than I have in ages because we've been here four days apart.
Never have I talked about you or our friendship in the past tense. Know it. And I do talk about you, if not to you. And I do miss you.
And perhaps my english has gone out the window in this entire year I've been out of school. Because I still am out of school. And I still am working that crappy job I always hated. I feel suspended in time. Away from the things I cherish the most. The only changing factor in my life is my age. And perhaps my state of mind. I've grown calmer. A bit more mature too, if I dare say. Can you tell? You who've known me for so long. You who've never met me but knew me (and still knows me) more than most people I see everyday.
I'm growing sappy too, in my old age. *flicks tentacles*
*sigh* to be to you the friend you've always been to me ( because yes, I also learnt to listen more and babble less)is what I aim for, for when I finally get internet back. (Because I will, one day...might be sooner than you think...I hope...)
*waves sadly*
looking forward to a day when seeing your name doesn't bring tears of longing to my eyes...
Re: ^_^
Date: 2008-02-29 02:46 am (UTC)Love. Just post your latest address,phone number heck even any number that can lead me to you ya. <3
Re: ^_^
Date: 2008-02-29 02:50 am (UTC)Re: ^_^
Date: 2008-02-29 02:51 am (UTC)<3 Seteshi-chan
Work well. You have to work you work. You will be repaid and all those fucked up evangelical shit later,yo. Because hell.
Karma. You shalt suffer now, but get your respite soon.
Work well darling,survive,survive. *holds your hand,callused but still beautiful <3*
Re: ^_^
Date: 2008-02-29 02:47 am (UTC)First, my baby novel. It's bright orange yet depressing. It hasn't learnt to walk yet 'cause it's still missing limbs. But it's there. It exists, it carries hope and I love it.
And my baby godson Zack. My sister went and had a baby with a demon. Baby Zack has almost learnt to walk and he spittles and tugs at my glasses and claps his hands when he's happeehappee. And my heart fills with such love for life when I see his pure blue eyes.
in hope to send a smile your way.
Re: ^_^
Date: 2008-02-29 02:58 am (UTC)I'm still stuck as Stacy.
Ya.
The Character. ^__~
Still using klchew2e@hotmail.com,yo.
When would you be on tomorrow tops? or today even, gimme your time zone..ill figure out myself. In uni. Vista is shit. my 30pages report,GONE.
So yes.
You Are The Light Of My Day.
Re: ^_^
Date: 2008-02-29 03:03 am (UTC)